Edip Yuksel vs. Ali Sina

Round IX - page 35

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Let us analyze this “surprise analysis”. Actually I am not surprised at all. You refused to answer the charges that I brought against the Quran. You kept hiding behind your favorite line of defense, accusing me of using the “trash of hadith”, when clearly that has not been the case. So you had two options. A) Do the honorable thing and admit that the Quran is a book of terror and violence, take the side of the truth and denounce Islam, or B) find an excuse to save face and weasel your way out of this debate. Regrettably you chose the second option - the less honorable route. Nonetheless, you are too transparent. 

My statement contains nothing racist or fascist. I do not believe people who murder, innocent people are humans. Our humanity is not defined by our physical appearance. What makes us humans is our humanness. A few days ago, in New Jersey, an entire family of four was brutally butchered. They were bounded, tortured, stabbed and their throats were slashed. The 16 year old daughter had a cross tattooed on her arm. That cross was particularly stabbed several times. Her 8-year-old sister's throat was cut and her chest was slit open. The only suspects of this grizzly crime are the Muslims. The Father of the victims who was a Coptic Christian was active in Internet chat- rooms denouncing Islamic persecution against his people back in Egypt . He was threatened two months earlier: "You'd better stop this bull, or we are going to track you down like a chicken and kill you.” This is not the kind of crime burglars commit. A burglar may kill someone just to get away. This was a crime of intense hate. Do you call those who committed this crime, humans? I don’t!  No one who is capable of such a monstrous acts can be called human.

The culprits of this horrendous crime have not been found but the act has the signature of Islamic terrorism all over it. But this is not an isolated case. Everyday Muslims commit monstrosities across the world.  Where do they get their inspiration from? They get it from the Quran. I already quoted many verses that incite terror and asked you for explanation. You never answered. All you said so far is that these are hadith trash. 

I reiterate once again. “The sign of humanity is in our humanness. No person who believes in those inhumane teachings of the Quran that calls for killing and murder of innocent people deserves to be called human. This is a war between humanity and a spiritually underdeveloped subhuman species. The actions of Muslims are barbaric. Their thoughts are beastly. They have no human conscience and they are preying on us humans. So this is a war between humans and a subhuman species called Muslims.”

Now you accuse me of including in this all the Muslims. Not so! I have stated time and again that most Muslims are not aware of the barbarity of the Quran and if they come to see what the Quran says they will not remain Muslims. One such example is Haifa , the lady I debated with a couple of days ago who after realizing that terrorism is not because of the misunderstanding of the Quran but a direct result of it. Her whole family left Islam in one day. Now I do not expect everyone to go from blind faith to enlightenment in one day after being exposed to truth. In fact if this were happen it would make me very depressed. It took me nearly one year of study and then another one or two years of living in limbo until I finally made my mind. If everyone is as fast as Haifa and her enlightened family then I would start thinking perhaps something is wrong with me for taking so long. Nonetheless, the majority of Muslims, sooner of later, will realize that the problem is with Muhammad and the Quran and will eventually leave this cult. 

The majority of Muslims are good people. They are merely born in a wrong cult. They are not expert in religion and are unaware of what the Quran teaches. You can’t call these people “subhumans”. They are simply misinformed. I always talk about my Muslim grandmother whom I consider to have been a saint. I am sure there are millions of saints among Muslims like her. So the title of inhuman does not apply to all those who think they are Muslims. These people don't know Islam. But if a Muslim believes in the inhumane teachings of the Quran, defends them and puts them to action, he can’t be called human.  

I asked you to define your position. Which side are you standing? Are you on the side of humans or are you a subhuman. This can be easily determined by your degree of adherence to the Quran.

Do you agree with the following: 

8:12 "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them " 

3:28, "Let not the believers take for friends or helpers Unbelievers"

4:84, "Then fight in Allah’s cause"

8:17, "It is not ye who slew them; it was Allah"

8:65, "O Prophet! Rouse the Believers to the fight".

9:5,  "Then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them,"

9:14, "Fight them, and Allah will punish them by your hands, cover them with shame"

9:23, "O ye who believe! take not for protectors your fathers and your brothers if they love infidelity above Faith"

9:28, "O ye who believe! Truly the Pagans are unclean"  

9:29, "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day"

9:123, "O ye who believe! fight the unbelievers who gird you about, and let them find firmness in you"

47:4, "Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers, smite at their necks; At length"  

3:85, "If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah), never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter He will be in the ranks of those who have lost (All spiritual good)".  

8:39, "And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah altogether and everywhere."

This is just a token. The Quran is filled with this kind of trash. Now tell me! Do you believe in them? If so how shall we call you a human? Nay, rather any person who believes in these barbaric verses of the Quran is a barbarian and a subhuman.  

You called me a fascist. Let us see how Dictionary.com defines fascism:  

"A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism."  

Islam tries to establish a centralized authority under the dictatorship of a Khalifa. The socio-economical rules of Islam, i.e. the laws of Sharia are extremely stringent. No opposition to Islam is tolerated and terror is exerted to silence any dissent or opposing voices and censorship is heavily practiced. This is all according to the explicit mandates of the Quran. Islam is belligerent by its nature as it is clear from many verses such as: 2:216 where it says fighting is prescribed for you and it is good for you. Islam is also “racist” in a religious sense. The supremacy of the cult members is not determined by the color of skin but by their belief and submission to the cult. Another good definition of fascism is the following verse:     

48:29, "Muhammad is the messenger of Allah; and those who are with him are strong against Unbelievers, (but) compassionate amongst each other."     

Fascism conquers by dividing people and uses victimization and hate to that end. It is an ideology of hate. It needs a scapegoat and a perceived enemy to unite people through their collective hate.  

Muhammad promoted unbounded hatred of unbelievers to rally believers around himself. Anyone who compares the Quran with the Mein Kampf would be surprised at the similarity of these two books.

However, I reject your characterization of me. I am not a fascist. I fight Islamic fascism. Just as it is absurd to call the Allies who fought against Nazism, war mongers and hate mongers, it is equally ludicrous to decry those who fight against Islamofascism as fascists. Islamic fascism is very much obvious to anyone who reads that tedious book of Quran. On the other hand our message at FFI is unity of mankind and abolition of all racial and religious hatred.

Islam is an anti human cult. This is clear from the Quran. Naturally we can’t tolerate it. Tolerating intolerance is absurd. Civilized societies must not only tolerate but celebrate human differences. Variety is good. Different races, different cultures and even different religions are like different flavors or different hues. The beauty is in diversity. At the same time that we celebrate this diversity, we have to protect it. Islam wants to eliminate this diversity. It wants to take away our freedom of thought and choice. It wants to enslave all of us under one fascistic rule of domination and mind control. It wants to establish a Borg society. Islam is not another color of the rainbow. It is the darkness of the night that eliminates all the colors. We have to unmask this wolf in sheep’s clothing and slay it. This is not intolerance. This is protecting tolerance. It is protecting our freedom, our diversity and our lives.

In my previous write up I suggested that Muslims should not be treated according to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights but rather according to the mandates of the Quran. Don’t they think the Quran is divine and perfect while the UDHR is manmade and imperfect? So they should be pleased if we treat them in exact same way that the Quran says the non-believers should be treated. Aren't they striving to make the Sharia the law of land in non-Muslim countries? We have to make sure they get their wish. But when I suggested this, you and your friend were horrified and called me a fascist and a hate monger.  

All I am proposing is to take the verses of the Quran and replace the “unbelievers” with “Muslims” and vice versa.  Let us see how they look:  

8:12 We will cast terror into the hearts of Muslims. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.  

3:28, Let not the non-Muslims take for friends or helpers the Muslims.  

8:65, Rouse the non-Muslims to the fight against Muslims.

9:5,  Then fight and slay the Muslims wherever ye find them,

9:14, Fight the Muslims, and God will punish them by your hands, cover them with shame.

9:23, O ye the non-Muslims take not for protectors your fathers and your brothers if they love Islam.

9:28, O ye the non-Muslims! Truly the Muslims are unclean.

9:123, O ye non-Muslims! fight the Muslims who gird you about, and let them find firmness in you.

47:4, Therefore, when ye meet the Muslims, smite at their necks; At length.  

Now, you think this is horrible? You think I am “the real subhuman, a vampire who is thirsty to suck the blood of more than a billion humans on this planet.”?  Are you totally shocked of my inhumanity? Do you think this is horrendous?

I wonder why! In writing these new laws I have tried to emulate the man who called himself "the best of the creation" and "a good example to follow". I tried to be as “compassionate” as he was. Don't you say the Quran is a miracle?. Don’t you say the Quran is the Message of Salvation? So why you call me a subhuman and a blood sucking vampire when I say exactly the same things your holy prophet said?  

When I said anyone who truly believes in the Quran is subhuman you called me a fascist. But looks like you agree with me after all. In fact you went even one step further and wrote: 

"To the coward vampire, who is instigating wars and genocides: You are the real subhuman, you are a vampire who is thirsty to suck the blood of more than a billion humans on this planet." You said a person who can write "such rabid and diabolic words" is a "monster using the mask of humanism" who "cannot be a human but a hatemonger and bloodthirsty creature that needs a leash around his neck” 

Very well said. I fully agree with you. Only a blood sucking vampire and a monster can have such diabolic mind to write such verses.     

Do you realize the absurdity of your stance?  

After calling me all these things for merely saying what the Quran says, you proceeded extolling your own virtues and your “uncompromising standing against violence, terror, wars, human rights violation and suppression of freedom”, etc. etc. What a great person you are dear Edip! Now can you please explain how a person of your caliber, someone who has an uncompromising standing against violence and terror, can think that the Quran is the word of God? Can you please explain to us why when these words are used against the non-Muslims they are divine and when I suggest we switch role and let the Muslims taste the very medicine that they prescribe for others, I am a monster and a bloodsucking vampire? 

When I said Muslims should be treated the way the Quran says non-believers should be treated, your fellow cultist said I am not following the Golden Rule. Well, maybe I am not! Who cares about me? I did not claim to be a prophet of God! But are you following the Golden Rule? Are the teachings of Muhammad based on the Golden Rule? How can you follow a religion with teachings such as these that only the mention of reversing the roles sends shiver down your spine and you call the person who makes that outrageous suggestion a vampire, a bloodsucking monster, a hate monger that needs a leash around his neck? If this is so bad, why you prescribe it for others? If this is so evil why you follow it?  

This is a very straightforward and simple question dear Edip. It has nothing to do with hadith. Can you please answer it? 

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