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Nadir Ahmed





Joined: 03 Jan 2004
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 10:59 am    Post subject: CHALLENGE TO DEBATE ALI SINA Reply with quote

CHALLENGE TO DEBATE

Topic: Quran and Modern Science
http://www.ExamineTheTruth.com


Alhumdulilah, the following anti Islamic personalities have been wiped out, exposed as frauds, and have fallen to the Sword of Islam!:


1. Dr. Robert Morey Evil or Very Mad ( www.faithdefenders.com)
http://www.examinethetruth.com/morey_challenge.htm


2. Sam "The Sham" Shamoun Evil or Very Mad ( www.answering-islam.org )
http://www.examinethetruth.com/on_the_run.htm
http://www.examinethetruth.com/apology_rejected.htm


3. Denis Giron Evil or Very Mad ( www.freethoughtmecca.org )
(Denis is an ok person not a liar...but he is just confused)


And Now... we have come for you, Ali Sina Twisted Evil


To many people have emailed me and asked me to refute this guy, under normal cirumstances, I only do public debates... so the humilation can be witnessed for all to see as in the case of Sam "The Sham" Shamoun from www.answering-islam.org , but I have gotten word that Ali Sina only does online debates, soo I will make this one exception for him.

The topic will be Quran and Modern Science, by the grace of God, In the Ahmed - Giron debate, the Quran has been proved to be authored by a source greater than man and rendered a true living miracle for all times. You can download the debate from my website:

http://www.ExamineTheTruth.com

All the cheap polemics of the Christians and Atheists have been silenced and refuted in this one debate. Therefore, we will give Ali Sina an opportunity to contest the evidence if he disagrees with the conclusion stated above. So, if Ali accepts, then he can download the debate, listen to it, and we will start our debate from their....

thanks,
Nadir Ahmed
www.ExamineTheTruth.com
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yeezevee



Joined: 20 May 2002
Posts: 2640

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Nadir_ahmed: CHALLENGE TO DEBATE


Good to hear from you Nadir... what is there in debates someone wins and some one looses.. Not a big deal. Welcome to FFI and educate the infidellic crowd.. I wonder whether you are from Indian subcontinent or are you from Arabian Peninsula? I saw these debates go different ways depending where the person is coming from..There backgrounds about ISLAM seems to be vastly different...

Please let your friends and well-wishers know about this forum.. so that they will read your fascinating debate...by the way, put a link of FFI to these
http://www.ExamineTheTruth.com www.answering-islam.org and other web sites, so that other experts also can come and debate.. So who is Mohammad any way? what is this Pillar bussiness in Islam?..tell us about Mr. Mohammad and his life ...

Oopps .. I scanned through your colorful site quickly.. It is all about Zakir? How is Naik doing in Mumba?i...Actually I requested that GUY to visit this site some time back.. offcourse he is Big man with lots books and lectures..it is good to hear THE MAN at this site . so let me add the links of Zakir over here...

http://www.ahya.org/realaudio/zakir/ult1.ram
http://www.ahya.org/realaudio/zakir/ult2.ram
http://www.ahya.org/realaudio/zakir/ult3.ram
http://www.ahya.org/realaudio/zakir/ult4.ram
http://www.ahya.org/realaudio/zakir/ult5.ram

Nadir.. Ask that guy to read more that of Q'uran, more detail.. There must be a recipe for High TC and Fuel recipe for Fusion...Also there may be a method to do brain surgery with out knives with Lasers...In fact.. what friends should do is carefully listen to Zakir .. forget about friend Bill Campbell.... Who is a Doctor of NT..OT.. So let us focus on Zakir.. open a new folder and let us export the opinions of the forummers to Mr. Zakir..
Nadirs realize that.. Here are the people who don't follow anything and dissect every thing

with regards
yeezevee
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mughal200



Joined: 16 Feb 2002
Posts: 522
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello, nadir,

greetings dear brother.

Welcome to the forum, it is very nice to have you with us.

I hope your participation here would be mutually beneficial. Here are some links if you have spare time on your hands.

http://www.muslimsandislamic.faithweb.com/contact.html

http://www.muslimsandislamic.faithweb.com/photo2.html

http://www.muslimsandislamic.faithweb.com/photo3.html

http://www.muslimsandislamic.faithweb.com/photo4.html

http://www.muslimsandislamic.faithweb.com/photo5.html

http://www.muslimsandislamic.faithweb.com/photo6.html

Regards and
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PeaceOnEarth



Joined: 13 Sep 2003
Posts: 91

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since Nadir Ahmed did not share enough information on the debate or on their views on Quran and Science, I did a little search to get the information for the forum's benefit:

Zakir Naik's backgrounder:
Zakir believes in Hadiths. I am not sure which translation of Quran he goes by for his debates.
http://www.drzakirnaik.com/pages/about/index.php

Here is a book by Zakir Naik on Quran and Science:
http://free.freespeech.org/sultan/qms.pdf
or http://www.dar-al-talaba.net/Specials/Quran_and_Modern_Science.html
Some videos on this topic: http://www.islamicwell.com/islamicscience.htm

Quran and Math: http://www.themodernreligion.com/science/math.html

Science and Islam are twin sisters: Laughing Laughing Laughing
http://www.themodernreligion.com/verses_sci.htm#index

More works of Zakir Naik:
http://www.irf.net/irf/download/index.htm
www.imc-usa.org/convention/misconceptions_islam.pdf

Debate with Campbell: http://www.ahya.org/invite/ultimate.html
Sam Shamoun: http://answering-islam.org.uk/Responses/Naik/

Peace
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"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt." - Russell
"The mind of a bigot is like the pupil of the eye. The more light you shine on it, the more it will contract."


Last edited by PeaceOnEarth on Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Ali Sina



Joined: 14 Feb 2002
Posts: 2244

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

CHALLENGE TO DEBATE

Topic: Quran and Modern Science
http://www.ExamineTheTruth.com


Alhumdulilah, the following anti Islamic personalities have been wiped out, exposed as frauds, and have fallen to the Sword of Islam!:


1. Dr. Robert Morey ( www.faithdefenders.com)
http://www.examinethetruth.com/morey_challenge.htm


2. Sam "The Sham" Shamoun ( www.answering-islam.org )
http://www.examinethetruth.com/on_the_run.htm
http://www.examinethetruth.com/apology_rejected.htm


3. Denis Giron ( www.freethoughtmecca.org )
(Denis is an ok person not a liar...but he is just confused)


And Now... we have come for you, Ali Sina


To many people have emailed me and asked me to refute this guy, under normal cirumstances, I only do public debates... so the humilation can be witnessed for all to see as in the case of Sam "The Sham" Shamoun from www.answering-islam.org , but I have gotten word that Ali Sina only does online debates, soo I will make this one exception for him.

The topic will be Quran and Modern Science, by the grace of God, In the Ahmed - Giron debate, the Quran has been proved to be authored by a source greater than man and rendered a true living miracle for all times. You can download the debate from my website:

http://www.ExamineTheTruth.com

All the cheap polemics of the Christians and Atheists have been silenced and refuted in this one debate. Therefore, we will give Ali Sina an opportunity to contest the evidence if he disagrees with the conclusion stated above. So, if Ali accepts, then he can download the debate, listen to it, and we will start our debate from their....

thanks,
Nadir Ahmed
www.ExamineTheTruth.com




Dear Nadir Ahmad,

Thank you for your interest to debate with me. I would be glad to do that. As I wrote in the prologue of this site

I reject Islam a) because of Muhammad’s lack of moral and ethical fortitude and b) because of the absurdities in Quran.

a) Muhammad lived a less than holy life. His lust for sex, his affairs with his maids and slave girls, his pedophilic relationship with Aisha a 9-year-old child at the age of 53, his killing sprees, his massacre and the genocide of the Jews, his slave making and trading, his assassination of his opponents, his raids and lootings of the merchant caravans, his burning of the palm plantations, his destroying the water wells, his cursing and invoking evil on his enemies, his revenge on his captured prisoners of war and his hallucinations about having sex with his wives when he actually did not, disqualify him as a sane person let alone a messenger of God

b) An unbiased study of Quran shows that far from being a “miracle” that book is a hoax. Quran is replete with scientific heresies, historic blunders, mathematical mistakes, logical absurdities, grammatical errors and ethical fallacies. Could possibly the author of this Universe be as ignorant as it appears to be in Quran?

So let us start with Muhammad’s character first. Then we move to Quran and will discuss it to see whether it is a miracle as Muslims say or a hodgepodge of nonsense and absurdities.

Since I am the accuser and you are the defendant, I will bring charges against Muhammad and it is up to me to prove that the charges are true. Then you can respond and prove that they are false.

To start I invite you to refute the charge of misogyny that I have brought against Muhammad. Here is the link:
http://www.faithfreedom.org/debates/Shahzad8.htm

Thank you again for your interest in debating with me.


Kind regards


Ali Sina
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Last edited by Ali Sina on Sat Jan 03, 2004 4:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Nadir_ahmed



Joined: 03 Jan 2004
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:42 pm    Post subject: science first Reply with quote

no ... no.. ali.... Im not going to let you run.... I have challenged you first, soo we start with Quran and Science first, you can later challenge me to what ever topic you want. Personally, I dont care what you think about Muhammed(P) that is NOT why I am here.. it means nothing to me. I mean, Who cares about what you think of "misogyny" ?

Right now, this Quran and Science debate should be your main focus, as I mentioned it *proves* that this book is a great miracle... and if this is true... then all of your EMOTIONAL arguments gets over ridden. Think about it, your worst nightmares are being confirmed , hundreds of people all over USA are being converted with this debate...


Therefore, we debate the OBJECTIVE evidences first... then we debate the SUBJECTIVE evidences later... (but by that time, it wont even matter because the objective evidences will be enough to convict the Quran as being a miracle, so who gives a hoot about personal feelings..)

So, please dont waste my time... lets get this debate on the road..

thanks,
Nadir Ahmed
www.ExamineTheTruth.com
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adnan



Joined: 29 Jun 2002
Posts: 2988
Location: Ex-Muslim from Pakistan, now in USA

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brother Nadir,
Alhumdulilah is spelled as Alhumdulillah.
I didnt see any of those people fallen to the Sword of Islam, infact you fell to the Shotgun of Common sense

Quote:
In the Ahmed - Giron debate, the Quran has been proved to be authored by a source greater than man and rendered a true living miracle for all times. You can download the debate from my website:
http://www.ExamineTheTruth.com

Denis Giron is still here on FFI, your claim is false and I dont see any debate which shows that Quran was not authored by man.
Quote:
hundreds of people all over USA are being converted with this debate

Yea Smile thats why the percentage of Americans who think that Islam is not peaceful has risen from a small number to a now 50%. Its you who's getting emotional.
I wait for the debate to begin between you and Ali on this forum.

Adnan
(former muslim from pakistan, now agnostic)
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MarkT



Joined: 14 Feb 2002
Posts: 1166
Location: On the globe that gave me birth-the cool green hills of Earth

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 2:49 pm    Post subject: quranic scientology Reply with quote

Nadir_ahmed wrote:
Think about it, your worst nightmares are being confirmed , hundreds of people all over USA are being converted with this debate...

Sorry bub, True Islam converted me long ago, it was his EMOTICONS that did the trick, see:
http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1282#1282
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Mullah Mo



Joined: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 670
Location: In HELL with Mohammed the Pedophile Prophet

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Laughing Laughing The sword of Islam?? That's not a sword man. That's a butter knife. Laughing

Bring a butter knife to a gun fight... Wink Nice try...

Now about Dr. Robert Morey. I don't know much about him but here's what I know....

Quote:
Robert A. Morey, the popular evangelical cult-watcher, who in recent years has targeted Islam as a deadly religion. Author of The Islamic Invasion, Morey has often debated leading Muslim apologists, in fiery exchanges that have led to mob attacks on him and repeated calls for his death. Morey has accused Muhammad of being a racist, a murderer, an irrational zealot, and a pedophile.

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2002/001/1.32.html


I will search for more on the attacks.

My question to you Mr. Ahmed is this..... If the Islamic world is winning the debate, why are Muslims getting emotional attacking or calling for the death of Mr. Morey??

After you lose this debate Mr. Ahmed, I'd say we should contact all the people that you claim you won the debates with and find out what really happened.


Peace.
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Ali Sina



Joined: 14 Feb 2002
Posts: 2244

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
no ... no.. ali.... Im not going to let you run.... I have challenged you first, soo we start with Quran and Science first, you can later challenge me to what ever topic you want. Personally, I dont care what you think about Muhammed(P) that is NOT why I am here.. it means nothing to me. I mean, Who cares about what you think of "misogyny" ?

Right now, this Quran and Science debate should be your main focus, as I mentioned it *proves* that this book is a great miracle... and if this is true... then all of your EMOTIONAL arguments gets over ridden. Think about it, your worst nightmares are being confirmed , hundreds of people all over USA are being converted with this debate...


Therefore, we debate the OBJECTIVE evidences first... then we debate the SUBJECTIVE evidences later... (but by that time, it wont even matter because the objective evidences will be enough to convict the Quran as being a miracle, so who gives a hoot about personal feelings..)

So, please dont waste my time... lets get this debate on the road..

thanks,
Nadir Ahmed
www.ExamineTheTruth.com



Dear Nadir Ahmad,

I accuse Muhammad of being unfit and unworthy to be a messenger of God. The character of Muhammad is very important to determine his truthfulness. Many people have said good things but it is their deed that is the litmus test of their claim. Suppose I write a wonderful book and give people good advises. Is that enough to prove me as a messenger of God? What if I am an assassin, a thief, a lecher, a liar, etc? Could I insist that people should not judge me by what I do but rather by what I say? Of course not! Remember what Muhammad said about himself:

"And surely thou hast sublime morals" (Q.68:4).
“Indeed in the Messenger of Allah you have a good example to follow" (Q.33:21).
We sent thee not, but as a Mercy for all creatures. (Q.21:107).
Verily this is the word of a most honorable Messenger, (Q.81.19)

If those claims are proven to be false then no amount of miracle would make him a prophet. If you can’t disprove the charges that I have made against Muhammad, then he is a liar and the above verses of the Quran are not true.

Even if the Quran is proven to be a “miracle” as you state, this does not prove that Muhammad was a messenger of God. If it is proven that he was an evil character unworthy of the rank of prophethood, then we can say that the Quran is the words of Satan or jnns.

6.112
Likewise did We make for every Messenger an enemy,- evil ones among men and jinns, inspiring each other with flowery discourses by way of deception. If thy Lord had so planned, they would not have done it: so leave them and their inventions alone.

As you see Muhammad believed in jinns. He even talked to them. Personally I have never seen a jinn, but Muhammad used to see them often. How do we know one of them did not pose as Gabriel and deceived him? Can you prove that this did not happen? The only way you can do that is to prove that Muhammad lived a saintly life.

I am afraid you cannot escape this one. If you want to make us believe Muhammad was a messenger of God you must show that he was worthy for that task. Proving Quran to be a miracle does not prove Muhammad to be a prophet.

However, since it seems that science and Quran is the lesson you have learned best and this is the only thing you want to talk about, I agree to discuss Quran first. I’ll show that the Quran is not from God but a hodgepodge of nonsense and you can show that it is a miracle. Let us agree however that at the end you have to disprove my charges against Muhammad. If you prove the Quran to be a miracle but fail to prove Muhammad was a prophet then all you have done is that you have proven that that book is the work of Satan.

I’ll write my first accusation against the Quran next.
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rand



Joined: 29 Jul 2002
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Nadir Ahmed,

Welcome to the site! I hope we can learn from each other. One of the links you cited refered to
http://www.islam-guide.com/frm-ch1-2.htm I found the surah like it challenge to be a logical fallacy.

Quote:
[2.23] And if you are in doubt as to that which We have revealed to Our servant, then produce a chapter like it and call on your witnesses besides Allah if you are truthful.


1. There are many people today that have read the quran and feel that it is at best a mediocre book. If we ask such people whether there has ever been a surah better than the a quranic surah, they would say yes. Why won't you accept that as a proof that the quran failed the challenge?
For example, Thomas Carlyle wrote:

http://www.islam4all.com/newpage111.htm

Quote:
We also can read the Koran; our Translation of it, by Sale, is known to be a very fair one. I must say, it is as toilsome reading as I ever undertook. A wearisome confused jumble, crude, incondite; endless iterations, long-windedness, entanglement; most crude, incondite;--insupportable stupidity, in short! Nothing but a sense of duty could carry any European through the Koran. We read in it, as we might in the State-Paper Office, unreadable masses of lumber, that perhaps we may get some glimpses of a remarkable man...
Mahomet's followers found the Koran lying all in fractions, as it had been written down at first promulgation; much of it, they say, on shoulder-blades of mutton, flung pell-mell into a chest: and they published it, without any discoverable order as to time or otherwise;--merely trying, as would seem, and this not very strictly, to put the longest chapters first. The real beginning of it, in that way, lies almost at the end: for the earliest portions were the shortest. Read in its historical sequence it perhaps would not be so bad. Much of it, too, they say, is rhythmic; a kind of wild chanting song, in the original. This may be a great point; much perhaps has been lost in the Translation here. Yet with every allowance, one feels it difficult to see how any mortal ever could consider this Koran as a Book written in Heaven, too good for the Earth; as a well-written book, or indeed as a _book_ at all; and not a bewildered rhapsody; _written_, so far as writing goes, as badly as almost any book ever was! So much for national discrepancies, and the standard of taste.



2. When it comes to specialized fields like computer programing, designing airplanes, calculus, there are clearly more informative books than the Quran. So there are books in certain respects are better than the Quran. Why doesn't this prove that the challenge has been met?

3. http://whatsthisthen.netfirms.com/unclearquran.html mentions many verses from the Quran with differing/contradictory translations. It is safe to say that with contradictory translations, at least one translator is wrong. But it does not stop with translations, there are different schools of thought, different commentators, and sects. Some accept hadiths others do not. Some rely on abrogation and iltifat more than others.
Assume a "muslim" takes the quran out of context, and believes in the quran but interprets it as the opposite of what quran teaches. The "Muslim" then believes in Quran because there was never a surah like it!! But the text as the "muslim" sees it is not a divine text since divine texts are perfect, so the "muslim"'s understanding of the text is human/fallible, and there would be better/more knowledgable/more ethical texts than that quran as viewed by that "muslim".
If a muslim misunderstands/misinterprets quran, is it blasphemous for him to admit that there is no surah like the surah that he witnesses?

===
The challenge is a logical fallacy. For example, regarding the Israeli/Palestinian conflict, no matter what approach the US takes, there will be problems. Suppose the next US president does a great job, he's deserving of the Nobel peace prize, but there is stll tension, problems and conflicts. When he gets criticized he can claim, do you think you have better ideas, produce a better and more comprehensive solution. I might admit that I cannot. But does that mean that his solution was Divine? Couldn't a divine plan have complete and enduring peace?
The Quran addresses a serious problem. The believers were struggling to get along with ther neighbors. The Quran offered a solution:

Quote:
[2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.


Quote:
[5.33] The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His apostle and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement,


Even if one were make the absurd argument that that most or even all humans could not design a better solution. Wouldn't it make sense to say that an All-mighty, all-merciful, All-Wise God could have invented a better solution?

Bst regards,
Rand
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mughal200



Joined: 16 Feb 2002
Posts: 522
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brother nadir,

If you are a traditional muslim, you have no right to interpret the quran against traditional tafaseer therefore you cannot prove any science in the quran. However, if you are a modern muslim, you have broken away from traditional islam and so you have no authority to speak for islam.

I call such muslims dictionary muslims because they take a word and twist and turn it till it says what they want it to say. Traditional islamic view is that god sent muhammad with a message as well as its explanation and that is what traditional tafaseer are all about ie they are copies of copies. For example, take any latest traditional tafseer and you will see the author stating quotes from earlier tafaseer as to what any particular verse means.

These people very strongly believed that all knowledge is contained in the quran and the hadith and that people's knowledge is decreasing with time, for they are not paying attention to the quran and the hadith as the earlier generations used to. These people also believed that you should not use your intelligence when it comes to religion, you should just follow the dictate eg imaam ghazaali was very much respected for his such views.

All traditional muslims believed in beating up their wives, having slaves and maids, killing infidels and apostates, stoning to death people for sodomy and sexual affairs out side marriage, killing people who steal or drink etc etc etc. bukhaari, muslim, abu dawud and other hadith books are full of terrible stuff.

Muhammad himself was no angel either as pointed out by brother ali in his various articles.

Coming to the quran, it is full of contradictions as regard beliefs and practices and other information as you would find out if you read some articles here.

I hope your joining this forum helps you see islam for what it really is.

Good luck and
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mughal200



Joined: 16 Feb 2002
Posts: 522
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear nadir,

You stated that you have challenged ali first, that is not true. He has been challenging since he created this site.

He has examined various aspects of islam and found it false and he is challenging anyone to prove his conclusions wrong.
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everybee



Joined: 03 May 2003
Posts: 968

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

TOPIC: "Quran and Modern Science" New! Incredible debate!
COMMENTS: IS THE QURAN THE WORD OF GOD? Alhumdulilah, this debate *proves* that the Quran could not be authored by man, rather a greater source had to have been the author of the Quran. Denis Giron, is one of the most advent opponenent of the Quran and Modern Science in the world today, and has done extensive research and debates on this topic. Denis Giron is also a writer for www.infidels.org. For this debate, please use my notes. to follow along.


from: http://www.examinethetruth.com/


That's a big load of horse crap. The Quran is one of the most poorly written books I've ever seen. Its full of logical fallacies and contradictions. For one thing it mentions the fairy tale of Adam and Eve. We know humans and other forms of life on earth evolved so that alone shows that the Quran has very little credibility. Noah and the Arc is mentioned, too. We discussed the impossibility of this story here, too. See:
http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=25
As far as proof of the Quran as being the word of God, we only have Mohammed's testimony which is questionable since he was a robber, rapist, pedophile, terrorist, criminal, charlitan and liar. Therefore, the Quran isn't worth the toilet paper its written on. The faster all of its copies are burned and destroyed, the better.
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SherKhan



Joined: 10 Mar 2002
Posts: 356

PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Nadir Ahmed,
I am impressed and looking forward to enjoying a healthy debate. You must be modern day Saladin to save Islam. However, I am feeling a little uncomfortable with your dual personality. This is what you wrote in your article “Islam or Christianity, Which is the true way to God?”

Quote:
Very briefly coming to Islam, Prophet Muhammed(P.B.U.H) claimed to be a Prophet, and received revelation from God, and gave mankind a Holy Scripture. Not only that but he claimed that he possessed the true message of Christ. This leaves us with two mortal human beings, with the same IDENTICAL claim!:

Prophet Muhammed(P.B.U.H) and Paul of Tarsus

In conclusion, it is crucial to understand the following point in order to answer the question, "which is the true way to God?":

BOTH CHRISTIANS AND MUSLIMS BELIEVE THAT GOD SENT A PROPHET AFTER JESUS CHRIST TO LEAD MANKIND ON THE TRUE PATH TO GOD. THE ONLY QUESTION IS, WHO IS THAT TRUE PROPHET AND WHO IS THE FALSE PROPHET!

Then you refuse to discuss about Muhammad………….
Quote:
no ... no.. ali.... Im not going to let you run.... I have challenged you first, soo we start with Quran and Science first, you can later challenge me to what ever topic you want. Personally, I dont care what you think about Muhammed(P) that is NOT why I am here.. it means nothing to me. I mean, Who cares about what you think of "misogyny" ?


Typical Islamic syndrome!!!!!!!!!

First you think it’s crucial to understand whether Muhammad was a fraud or a prophet then you refuse to discuss about this criminal. It’s a very simple rule, No Muhammad no Quran. It’s imperative to prove whether we should believe Muhammad or not.

Let’s say, the Mullah or Imam (Muslim priest) of your closest mosque is an alcoholic and he loves to rape young girls. He is also an expert shoplifter. Would you let him lead the prayer or obey his advice?
_________________
Religion makes a person blind folded, self centered and selfish.


Last edited by SherKhan on Sat Jan 03, 2004 6:10 pm; edited 1 time in total

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