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M.F. Rahman vs. Ali Sina
Page 4
2005/03/09
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Dear Mr. Rahman,
You ask: "which was the deciding factor for me
to realize Islam is false after reading the Quran?".
I can’t put my finger on one specific verse as the
deciding factor. I was already familiar with most of the Quran reading
bits and pieces of it here and there. But when I sat down to actually
study this book – and I studied it in Arabic using a couple of English
translations to make sure I don't miss anything – it became increasingly
evident that the book does not contain any divine wisdom, that it is
filled with violence, that it incites hate, and is patently stupid. You
read one verse that does not sound right but you want to go on and try to
overlook this particular verse searching for the pearls; but instead of
pearls you find more dung. After you finish this book you wonder, what the
heck it is talking about? Where are the spiritual teachings? Why you are
not uplifted and enlightened?
Despite that experience, I did not decide to become
an apostate overnight. At that time there were no sites like
faithfreedom.org so I could further my studies, I relied entirely on my own
resources and went through a period of very hard time of soul searching. I
wrote about this difficult experience here.
Finally an apostate friend handed me Ali Dashti's "23 Years:
A Study of the Prophetic Career of Muhammad" :and that book
gave me the confirmation that I needed.
You ask about my religion and deity. I already
explained this to your friend Mr. Zakaria. I am a secular humanist and do
not believe in any religion or deity. Albeit, I am not an atheist in the strict sense
of this word! I believe in the Principle underlying the creation. This is
not a being or an entity. It is more like Einstein and Spinoza's God. However, I have no desire to impose my way of
thinking on others. I respect people who have a religion and a god to whom
they pray and on whom they rely. That is why you never see me criticizing
other religions even though I do not believe in them. People have to find
their own way and no one said my way is better. Some say religion is but a
crutch. My response to them is: If so, who the hell are you to want to take
that crutch away from those who need it?
The reason I oppose Islam is because it is a doctrine
of hate and destruction. I do not fight Islam because it is a religion but
because it is a political movement much like Nazism and fascism. It only
masquerades itself as a religion to advance its political goals. You and I
perfectly know that the ultimate goal of Islam is to overthrow the
democracies and dominate the world. This is very political and hence the
world must fight it politically. We must fight the political Islam; but
since the political Islam is Islam, we must fight Islam.
You try to blame the “pre Islam” practices for
the wrongs of Islam. I agree that there is a difference between the pre
Islam and post Islam, but I prefer the pre Islam. In pre Islam Arabs were
tolerant. Religious animosity was inexistent. Jews, Christians, Sabeans,
Zoroastrians, and at least 360 different pagan religions lived side by
side. The followers of these religions worked with each other,
intermarried and religious wars was unknown to the Arabs. Arabs had tribal
quarrels like everywhere else but nothing like when they converted to
Islam. With Muhammad the genocide of the Jews and Christians began and the
city of
Yathrib (Medina)
that had been basically founded by the Jews who had lived there for
2000 years, and eventually the whole Arabia was ethnically cleanses by
Muhammad and his thugs.
Arab Women prior to Islam had far more rights. This is true in all Islamic countries. See
this article for detail.
Islam also legitimized the violation of human rights
and took away personal freedoms.
So, pre Islam was much better than after Islam. We
can’t keep our head in the sand for ever. We have to acknowledge the
source of the problem. The source of the problem is Islam, not Muslims.
You say: “To condemn
anyone for his pre-reformation behaviour is perverse.”
Obviously you are not familiar with my writings. I am saying
Muhammad was at first almost Christlike. At first he spoke of patience and
tolerance. All that changed when he came to power. We don’t know much
about Muhammad's pre “revelation” life. But we know he was
completely transformed after he went to
Medina
and became powerful. Before he was not that bad, but then he became a real
monster. Muhammad exemplified the adage "power corrupts"
Muhammad and Allah are one
and the same thing, my dear Mr, Rahman. Allah is the figment of
Muhammad’s mind. Even if there is a God, he is not Allah and he had
nothing to do with Muhammad. Allah is Muhammad’s alter ego. It is like
you creating another fictitious Internet id that would come to your help
anytime you need him, who would confirm whatever you say and occasionally
rebuke you gently and lovingly so you can fool others making them believe
you and your fake id are two different persons. Ask Mr. Zakaria, he
invented an Internet id who came to our forum and said that Mr. Zakaria is
the greatest philosopher of our time. Now, who but himself would give
such a approving mark of him? Now imagine he had convinced us into
believing this fake id of him is the greatest authority on Earth. Wouldn't
some of us have fallen for the trick. Muhammad used the same trick. His
Allah was his own fake id. It was his own alter ego. This is an old trick
used by all cult leaders. .
Instead of threatening me
with the punishments that Muhammad’s fake id has in store for
me, why don’t you give a single proof that he was actually telling the
truth? I am asking you to give me one single proof that Muhammad was
indeed a prophet of God and not a liar. There are 1.2 billion Muslims and
all I am asking is one single proof that can’t be refuted logically. Are
you telling me that you have none? Yes indeed you disappoint me Mr. Rahman.
You wrote a book on Islam and now you tell me that you can’t even prove that
Muhammad was a prophet? You want me to believe in this man just because he
threatened those who do not believe in him with hellfire?
Why don’t you believe in
me? I tell you if you deny my divinity you will be burned in a hell twice
as hot as the one Muhammad described. Is that enough? In fact you'll be
taken to a place that Muhammad's hell will look like picnic. Is that
enough to convince you that I am a messenger of God?
You have based your faith
on a man who has not given you a single proof that he was not lying. All
he did is to call those who did not believe in him, “deaf,
dumb, and blind, they are void of wisdom” 2:171.
When he was pressed for proof he said,
“As to those who reject
Faith, it is the same to them whether thou warn them or do not warn them;
they will not believe.” 2:6
In this way he balked and
avoided the question altogether. He resorted to ad hominem, he resorted to
ad baculum, he resorted to ridicule and scorn but he never answered the
question.
This is pathetic! A
billion of you believe in a lie concocted by a psychopath who lived a life
filled with crimes, genocide, lust for sex, control and power, and none of
you pauses for one minute to wonder if this man was truly a messenger of God why
he never gave us any logical proof. What puts this man apart from David
Koresh, Jim Jones or Charles Manson who also were charismatic leaders and
fooled their followers to commit murder and even suicide to prove their
loyalty? Would really the true God send a messenger without any
proof?
Forget about the proof.
What about the charges that I have brought against him? Can you disprove
any of them? You can’t. No one can. There is a $50,000 dollars reward
for anyone who can prove those charges are not true. If you can’t
disprove me, it shows Muhammad was guilty as charged. How can one billion
people worship and follow a man who was the embodiment of all the vices?
Who cares what you
believe. What bothers me is that you are promoting your satanic cult and
trying to dominate the world. We have to stop you. I don’t give a damn
if someone wants to worship snakes, rats, Hobal or Allah. As long as they
don't try
to take away my freedom and are not trying to dominate the world, people
must have the freedom to believe in anything they like. But I
can’t close my eyes and do nothing when a bunch of Satan worshippers are
spreading their hatred and are bombing and killing innocent people. You are
dangerous to the society. You are dangerous to Mankind. You must be
unmasked and stopped. You might be misguided but you
are now a zombie programmed to kill. There is no rationality in you. I am asking a simple
question. Prove that Muhammad was a messenger of God. You can’t. You
are willing to talk about anything else but the question that is the core
of our discussion. You would rather talk about
America, the "Joooos", the crusaders, the
Hiroshima, the WWI and WWII but not give one proof that Muhammad was
a messenger of God. When it comes to this vital question, all you can do
is to resort to threat of hell and tell me if I don’t believe I
will have to answer to your bugaboo Allah who is a sadist and will burn
people in his cosmic rotisserie for eternity. That is all you have as the
"proof". You either call people; deaf, dumb and blind who do not
understand, as your prophet did, or you threatened them with punishment
for not believing in his lies. If this is not intellectual bankruptcy
what is?
You
say: “Know that Muhammad is deemed The Prophet by the Quran”. But
isn’t the Quran what this man dictated? What if he was lying? It boils
down to this:
Muhammad:-
Hey people I am a prophet!
People: -
Where are your credentials?
Muhammad: -
Here is a letter that I have written that says I am a prophet.
People: -
But this is your own words.
Muhammad: -
No this is what Allah dictated and I wrote it.
People: -
How can we know you are not lying?
Muhammad: -
You are deaf, dumb and blind and you’ll burn in hellfire. 2.171.
6.39,
8.22.
17.97
Stupid people aka Muslims: -
Whoa! What a convincing argument! We believe.
Muhammad: -
Now let us go and raid merchant caravans.
Muslims: -
But isn’t stealing unethical?
Muhammad: -
No! Because you became poor after following me and are no more
working, Allah has given you
the right to lay hand on other people’s property. Also they oppressed
you. You can kill them. Oppression is worse than killing 2:217
Now let us attack villages without warning and take the population by
surprise while they are heedless and their cattle is being watered at
places of water. We will kill their fighting men and take their women and
children as captives. Remember that the prettiest of the captives is my
share. [Bukhari
3.46.717
]
Muslims: -
But isn’t raping married women sin?
Muhammad: -
No! Incidentally Allah sent me a verse this morning saying it is
okay to have sex with your right hand possessions. 4:24
So rape them with clear conscience. But always remember that the prettiest
captive belongs to Allah and his messenger. [Bukhari1.8.367]
Also from now on you
don’t have to practice coitus interruptus. Go ahead and ejaculate inside
your victims "for if any soul is predestined to exist, it will exist".
[Bukhari
3.46.718 5.59.459
Abu Dawood 29.29.32.95
29.29.32.96]
One day Muhammad was
walking with history's greatest fool, Abu Bakr.
Muhammad: -
Hey Abu, you got this little girl Aisha. The angel showed her to me
in a wet dream and told me she is mine. And you know? "If this is
from Allah, then it must happen." Bukhari
9.87.140
Abu Bakr trying to
protest sheepishly: -
But Aisha is only 6 years old. She is just a baby. She is still playing
with her dolls. [Bukhari
8, 73,151]
Muhammad: -
Okay you give her to me in marriage and I will wait until she becomes 9
years old before I go to her and give her the surprise of her life [Bukhari7,
62,90] I will give her a different kind of doll to play with.
wink, wink!
The great fool Abu Bakr:-
But I am your brother.
Muhammad: -
"You are my brother in Allah's religion and His Book, but she
(Aisha) is lawful for me to marry.". Bukhari
7.6218
One day Muhammad goes to
visit one of his wives, Hafsah, the daughter of Omar. He sees Mariyah,
Hafsah's Coptic maid and becomes horny. He sends Hafsah out telling her, Omar
wants to see you. When she goes out, he calls Mariyah and has sex with her
in Hafsah’s bed. Mariyah is soooo hot that for the first time in a many
years the aging prophet has a full erection and she becomes pregnant.
She is the only woman out of a score of women with whom Muhammad had sex after Khadijah that becomes pregnant. Hafsah finds out that her father had
not send for her and comes back to find her illustrious husband, naked, between
the legs of her maid. Being a woman, she does what women usually do in similar
situations. She screams and starts making a scandal. (Can’t women
respect even a prophet?) Taken by surprise, Muhammad tries to calm down
his hysteric wife and promises her not to approach Mariyah again while
pulling up his pants, and begs her to keep
the incident, a secret. Hafsah can’t keep her mouth shut and informs
Aisha who gangs up with a group of other co-wives and make the life
miserable for the Messenger of Allah. When the Messenger of Allah has
enough of this nonsense he makes his Allah reveal Surah Tahrim in
which he "rebukes" Muhammad telling him:
Q.66:
-5.
1. O Prophet! Why do you ban (for yourself)
that which Allâh has made lawful to you, seeking to please your wives?
And Allâh is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
2. Allâh has already ordained for you (O men), the dissolution of your oaths. And Allâh is your Maula (Lord, or
Master, or Protector, etc.) and He is the All-Knower, the All-Wise.
3. And (remember) when the Prophet (SAW) disclosed a matter in
confidence to one of his wives (Hafsah), so when she told it (to another
i.e. 'Aishah), and Allâh made it known to him, he informed part thereof
and left a part. Then when he told her (Hafsah) thereof, she said:
"Who told you this?" He said: "The All-Knower, the
All-Aware (Allâh) has told me".
4. If you two (wives of the Prophet SAW, namely 'Aishah and Hafsah
turn in repentance to Allâh, (it will be better for you), your hearts are
indeed so inclined (to oppose what the Prophet SAW likes), but if you help
one another against him (Muhammad SAW), then verily, Allâh is his Maula
(Lord, or Master, or Protector, etc.), and Jibrael (Gabriel), and the
righteous among the believers, and furthermore, the angels are his
helpers.
5. It may be if he divorced you (all) that his Lord will give him
instead of you, wives better than you, Muslims (who submit to Allâh),
believers, obedient to Allâh, turning to Allâh in repentance,
worshipping Allâh sincerely, fasting or emigrants (for Allâh's sake),
previously married and virgins.“ [Tarikh
Tabari also see Bukhari3.43.648
]
Isn’t Allah nice to his
prophet? He
rebukes him for banning himself to have sex with Mariyah when
Allah has made this lawful to him. Then he tells his beloved prophet that
he does not have to keep his words just to appease a bunch of women. Go ahead
Allâh has already ordained for you the dissolution of your oaths. And
as the bounty, now all men are licensed to dissolve their oaths (especially
when they become horny) because Allah is the
All-Knower, the All-Wise. Allah even
tells his beloved prophet to divorce all of his uppity wives if they are
not obedient and content with his sexual escapades and marry lots of other
women who will be better..
Whoa! What a great wisdom.
In another
occasion this very "All-Knower, All-Wise god" of Muhammad rebukes his prophet for
telling his foster son to keep his wife when he lusts for her.
33.37
“Behold! Thou didst say to one who had
received the grace of Allah and thy favour: "Retain thou (in wedlock)
thy wife, and fear Allah." But thou didst hide in thy heart that
which Allah was about to make manifest: thou didst fear the people, but it
is more fitting that thou shouldst fear Allah. Then when Zaid had
dissolved (his marriage) with her, with the necessary (formality), We
joined her in marriage to thee: in order that (in future) there may be no
difficulty to the Believers in (the matter of) marriage with the wives of
their adopted sons, when the latter have dissolved with the necessary
(formality) (their marriage) with them. And Allah's command must be
fulfilled.
How wise! The noblest institution of child adoption is annulled because
Muhammad was horny and wanted to have sex with the wife of his foster son.
There are so
many cases that I can bring as evidence that Muhammad made up these verses
to satisfy his own selfish needs. If you drop that blinder of gullibility
you'll find the entire Quran is nothing but a pretext for Muhammad to
dominate the foolhardy.
You wrote a
book on Islam. You are supposedly a scholar of this freak religion. Are you
saying that you did not see the elephant in the room?
The first time I read the
Quran I realized it is a hoax. Since then I continued my research and have
brought a well documented case against Muhammad. How could you not see the
obvious? Where is your brain Mr. scholar of Islam? How can you not see
that Muhammad made up the whole damn thing for his own benefit? If I tell
you I am a prophet of God would you believe me? If the only proof I
present is that if you don’t believe me you’ll be burnt in hell would
you believe me? If not, why you believe Muhammad? Why you believe a man
who was so evil and had no proof of his claim except frightening you with
hell? Isn't this hell foolish? What
kind of God would punish people in this sadistic way? Is Allah Satan? Even
Satan must have some compassion. Only a deranged psychopath can envision
a deity so ruthless as Allah.
Why would God be so desperate to be known and worshiped anyway? Isn't this
whole concept a lunacy? How can you let yourself be fooled like a child Mr. Scholar? Aren't you
embarrassed of your naiveté? Are you consoled by the fact that there are other billion
people who are just as fool as you are?
This is the
greatest madness. How can a billion people act like zombies and never
question what was the proof of Muhammad? Why no one asks if he was a
prophet of God, why he was so evil? How could a prophet of God have sex
with a 9 year old child? Aren’t you shocked? Don’t fool yourself with
excuses such as "this was the custom of the people in those days".
This is not true at all. We don’t have any other anecdote of a 53 year
old man marry a 9 year old girl and have sex with her prior to Muhammad.
This tradition started with that evil man.
David Koresh also slept with teenager daughters of his followers. Is this
a custom of today's people? Hell no! The cult leaders set their own rule
and they consider themselves above the law.
Furthermore, even if what you say is true, did Muhammad come to follow the bad customs of the
people or to guide them to the right path and set new standards? What he
did has become the standard and the guideline of a billion brainless
zombies. How can you let this happen?
How much foolishness is enough Mr. Muslim Intellectual Scholar?
There is so
much evil in Muhammad. All it take is to use a little bit of commonsense
to see he was an impostor and not a prophet of God.
You say “The Quran
corrects him in several places and admits his faults and forgives him as
well.”
How naïf of you Sir! If
you claimed to be a prophet and then said something, which you wanted to
change, how would you do that? Can't you see this is a childish game
that he played to fool his followers? How else he could have everything he
desired and break every norm of decency without incurring the wrath of his
followers unless he did not make his Allah rebuke him for being too harsh
on himself? How foolish of you Sir for falling for the scams of
that charlatan.
One day he found expedient
to say Lat,
‘Uzza and Manat
"These are the exalted cranes (intermediaries)
whose intercession is to be hoped for."
to appease the Meccans. Once he realized that he has goofed and with this
admission he is undermining his own claim of prophethood, how could he get out of this mess? He
makes his Allah to say these were
satanic verses and that Satan had placed them in his mouth. So he takes
the blame for being fooled by Satan and also makes his Allah forgive him.
How can you not see this plot? How can you be so gullible?
At the end you have the
cheek to say: “Even though most of your allegations against him are
simply exaggerated untruths, he has been forgiven completely in the
promise of the Quran.”
I don’t know what to
say! Have you ever given the thought that it is possible that Muhammad
concocted the Quran and this book may not be a book of revelation? How can
you be so gullible Mr. Scholar of Islam? So the Quran forgives him?
Doesn't this mean that he is forgiving himself? If he was a liar, doesn't
this mean that the Quran could also be a lie forged by him? What proof you
have that the Quran is from God? Present that proof and let us discuss
it.
Then you end your message
by saying:
"How
can I help you further?"
Really?
...You?... Help me?
You certainly have a good sense of humor.
Okay! Let us play your
game. Please give me one proof so I know for certainty that Muhammad was
not liar. That is all I ask you.
All I am asking from 1.2 billion people who call
themselves Muslims to give me one solid evidence that Muhammad was a
prophet of God. Do you people have any proof? Is your faith based on logic
or sheer stupidity? Isn't it odd that God gave no proof to back up his favorite
prophet and now he must compete with all other charlatans and impostors to
establish his claim? Tell me what sets Muhammad apart for other cult
leaders who also have no proof to their claim and yet threaten the stupid
people that if they do not believe they will go to hell?
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