Countering the Challenge of Ali Sina

Great reply by Ali Sena... Up until mid of 20th century no Muslim ever denounced ahadith. However, when non-Muslims started reading Quran and ahadith, educated Muslims became aware of the horrors in hadith. It is a sign of reformation. They discard ahadith today and discard Quran tomorrow. Finally Islam will be wiped out...

Alisina you are right .All Quronic verses are just fictious creation of psychic Mohammad.THe greatpeople like Winston churchill ,Jiddu krishn murthy,Anniebesant and Mustafa Kemal Atatürk understood it a century before .But now it has time came for islams natural death in the fire of truth.islamists suppress their logic and conscience only in for the fear of psuedo hell .Mothers love is the highest on this earth.Gods love must be equal to it or even higher than this.God if all exists must love and not punish his own creation like slave owner and master .that to in palm fire onot in fireof any onother fire like takewood fire.All Quron reveals desert man mindset with hate and personality disoreder makin contradictions.Muslims still hide this by saying allahs knows better but don't know allah character made is creation of mohammad schizo mind.

Both Ali Sina and P.A. Wahid translate and interpret in their own vision whatever Muhammad happened in last 1400 years ago. If we look at the history of last ten year, we still can find differences in difference books. 1400 years is far far away back.
I also found out that Ali Sina is trying to put Islam as Muhammad’s Religion.
But Muslims Claim that Islam is Allah’s (God’s) Religion.
This is a major difference and challenge.
Therefore, no one will get right conclusion.

Well nice debeat going on...well its my wish tht it should come to some end..so ppl will understand the reality...

well i dont have any issue wid Both of thm but still confuse...
i heard tht wid hadith you are not able to understand Quran...and if there is something which you cant understand in Quran...thn its good for you to refer to hadith and get the guidence...
well take a look of the once sentence of MR. P. A. Wahid
"Prophet Muhammad was fully in accordance with Allah’s guidance. "
so Allah was so loving tht he allowed him to perfrom loads and loads of sex...widout any problem...kill loads and loads of ppl widout any reason...
i still dont understand y he did tht..
if i've something...and i want to show this to ppl...some ppl accept it and some ppl dont..
Jst take the Example of COMPUTER WINDOWS

Bill Gates invented windows server2008...

but look at ppl...some say only windows XP is perfect coz it is frndly for user and user can easily understand..but a developer r a programmer will say 2008server is best...
but Bill gates didnt come out wid anger and killing ppl..
y bcoz he is not forcing ppl to accept things...wat ever you wanna use you can use its...
but in the reference wid MOhammed....he impose things,,,those who dont belive him..he killed there males...rape there wives and daughters...come on man.,,,if i'm not agree wid you...y u r forcing things on me..go and do ur work...

If mohammaed was really a role model...thn i dont know y majority of the ppl living in earth call him wid many bad words...like rapist,murder and bla bla..
wat is the reason behind this....if he was doing wat Allah(according to muslims allah is god but i dont belive) wants him to do...thn allah was really not a GOD..infact wat ever Ali Sina Wrote Ab8 mohmmed he shouldnt wrote aginst him...he should change the Title of HIS book with " UNDERSTANDING ALLAH"
coz what ever mohammed did..he was guided by allah..like his sex life wid maria...he cheated his wife and done sex wid his wife maid maria....an other example of Javaria..

Dear Ali sina i think you should change the title of your BOOK....mohammed was so inoccent...he only did wat allah said him to do...y u r abusing mohammed...
instead of this...
write another book...

UNDERSTAND ALLAH...

The reality is in denying hadiths muslims are in desperate state of mind in their vain attempts to save their beloved religion, islam. In one case I read about about an article written by muslims playing hard to change the age of Aisha, using some consipiracy theories to establish that the age of Aisha was 18 when she had betrothed allah's apostle. Imagine! from 9 to 18, exactly twice the actual age!

This has led me today to never trust any muslim in some critical issues. I no more trust a professor who is a muslim. I no more attend clinics with muslim doctors. Please muslims dont consider me as someone bigoted but I see it as something suicidal when you put a trust in someone who sees black as white, wrong as right and muhammad as a saint, even worse when you have unlimited evidences, such as hadiths and quran, potraying the opposite.

After reading this debate I realised that Islam is the only true religion of Allah (sw) and I have commited a grave mistake by apostizing from Islam.
I hereby declare that I am returning back to the fold of the one and only true religion "Islam".
I thank and praise Allah (sw) for showing me the right path and I also ask for forgiveness from Allah for treading on the path of falsehood.
I will renew my solemn oath to Allah (sw) by pronoucing the Kalima.

Amy the curses of Allah (sw) be upon all of you for defaming the greatest man to have walked the earth, prophet Muhammad (sw). You shameless moronic kafirs will burn in hell for your words about our beloved Prophet Muhammad (sw).

Dear Ibrahim
I hope the ansars of islam have not got you. You are way beyond the Rubicon my friend.

I have found great peace in islam and am trying to get converted to islam.My confusion is
should I become a sunni or a shia or ahmedi or a sufi or Bohra or?????
Do I get the services of 72 virgins straight away or I need to wait? Is there a waiting period?
I pronounce the shada
" La illahi illallah, mohammada rasool allah"
copy paste 3 times! Lo and behold I am a moslem.
Bring on the virgins.Ahhhh woo lallala

The story of the Prophet of mercy showing kindness to a Jewish woman who was hostile to him is all over the media.I have read this story a dozen times.The problem is why does this story finds no mention in the hadiths. Simple. It is not true. It never happened. I am not surprised that Muslims have plagiarized this story from the Bahais attributed to their founder Abdul Baha. Now this gentleman, P. A. Wahid ,wants everyone to discard the hadiths saying they are not reliable.The truth is that Muslims are so embarrased about the hadiths and are in a state of desperation to find some saving grace. Good enough. Tommorow they will want to discard the Quran also.

Ibrahim. Are you serious or joking, Or seriously joking?

#6 My dear Ibrahim, are you reverting. You mean you escaped the sword for defecting in the first place.

As salamo Alykom Wa Rehmatullahi Wa Barakatuhu

My dear kafir slaves. Yes I have reverted back to Islam bcos it the the one and only true religion of Allah (sw). Which other religion gives a man the right to marry four women, rape infidel women at will, take infidel men for slaves!
Is there one? No not even one, bcos all of them are fake religions, only Islam is the one true religion.
Our prophet was so merciful that he used to behead people when he could have easily tortured and killed them slowly. So you see, this is an example of his mercy! That stupid Jewish woman was very fortunate to be raped by the merciful prophet of Islam, may peace and blessings of Allah be upon him.

I will go to paradise, drink wine to my fill, have sex with my 72 houris and 28 gilmans and for that I am getting my suicide vest ready!

Be prepared All ye! infidels....here I come..........................

absolutely enlightening debate...i fear for Mr. Wahid that he might become an ex-muslim at the end of this debate..and will be killed for apostasy...

Dear Dr. Sina, Greetings brother and thank you

Do you mind giving us some minimal info about Mr. Wahid. He seems knowledgeable about Islam though. thank you.

Just to straighten things out, the founder of the Bahaì fath was Baha"u"llah his son was Abdul Baha and his grandson was Shogi Effendi, and now I have to say hehe I,m not a bahaì

You're serious, Ibrahim:)

Off course Ibrahim is serious.
I work in Allah's post office. I just shipped Ibrahim 28 houris and 7 Ghilmans. We are running short of houris these days. I placed a back order for Ibrahim, so he should be pleased. He'll get all his houris in less than a month. Thats good, considering that Allah's post office is working very hard to please the Jihadis nowadays.

.

I found great peace in Islam. My husband beats me everyday, I can't leave my house, and my father in-law makes daily "visits". I cannot speak my mind nor talk back to my husband, must give in to his sexual desires even when I am not in the mood, and I am covered from head to toe. Being a Muslimah is great.

loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool

Hi Marie and RH

Glad you all joined the great pedophilia cult.

Finally, Our brother Ibrahim have come to his senses and joined the thug and band leader of thieves and murderer, Muhammad, may he rot in the deepest pit of hell for what he did to all human beings around the world.

Look at this link my good friends, and tell me that Islam is not from the devil:

http://www.compassdirect.org/en/display.php?page=news&length=long&lang=e...

Peace to all

#21 Allah IS the DEVIL from his own words! sura 3:54

The kafirs deserve death for their apostasy! Allahu Akbar! Ouch my bleeding knuckles still hurt from the beating.

P. A. Wahid info:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=P.+A.+Wahid+&btnG=Google+Search&aq=...

# 21. Ibn Kammuna Says:

"Hi Marie and RH

Glad you all joined the great pedophilia cult. "

You don't have to invite them; as the following links prove, they are already in to that cult .-smile-

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/abuse-report-state...

http://news.yahoo.com/nphotos/Commission-to-Inquire-into-Child-Abuse/pho...

Bismiallah Ar rehman Ar Rahim

My dear infidellic abeeds and maumluks

I hereby confirm in the name of Allah the most gracious, most merciful that I shall be comming soon to your houses with my Ak-47 and the Quran and make you a lifetime offer! Yes! I will either offer you to convert to Islam or die at gunpiont.
You don't need to worry about your sons and daughters! We Muslims know how to take care of them. After all isn't that what Islam is all about, loving sharing and caring.
So get ready and make sure that you cook halal meals for me, failing which I will deprive you of the chance to make it paradise and get your vigins.

Well, hats off to Sina

I just finished reading part II of the debate. My view is this: Dr. Wahid just doesn't want to admit the damaging hadiths about his prophet are authentic, even though there is no way around it if one is to be honest to the truth. Why? I think it is a psychological problem more than anything for Dr. Wahid (and I welcome Dr. Wahid's response to my analysis here). He just can't bring himself to accept the truth. This debate is not about Sina or Wahid. it is about searching for the truth about Hadiths and accepting it regardless. It is clear, for instance, that Muhammad was a pedophile. Multiplicity of hadiths are available on this one, yet, Dr. Wahid is still denying that Muhammad was a pedophile. You see, if Wahid admits that, where does it stop? and if admittance is done, the house of cards will fall down like a Goliath hit by David's stone, and death is but eminent. I do feel for Dr. Wahid, all those years of inventing Qur'anic science, prayers, fasting, ..its a life time that was wasted. But why waste any more time Dr. Wahid? It is not going to do you any good. Isn't it time to look for a greener pasture?
From my heart, I wish you the best Dr. Wahid. admitting the truth is no weakness, and learning the truth is an honor, even if it takes a lifetime. Peace, we all need it inside and out (and this is the opposite of what Muhammad brought to our planet. You can take what I am saying here to the bank).

yea, looks like being moslem is trend in 21th century and fun too, think i want to convert, my main reason to convert is bcos i can use my wife as a tilth, here i came baby..., open the back door....ahhh, allhamdulilah.
thanks mohamad you know how to enjoy life.

halalpork

How dare you assign the great virtue of paedophilia to some man made religion. Islam has an absolute monopoly over the virtue of paedophilia and rape.
May Allah (sw) grow throw a thousand curses on you.

# " ibrahim ;

Thing is I never dared , it is the world press and " Ireland's Roman Catholic-run institutions says priests and nuns terrorized thousands of boys and girls in workhouse-style schools for decades — and government inspectors failed to stop the chronic beatings, rapes and humiliation."

See I am not to be held responsible for the Catholics: if they decided to follow the sunnah of Islamic Pedo. prophet MoHamMad.

Well the question remains if the chicken first or the eggs first ? I mean if the Xians become Pedo. first or MoHamMad ?

Ahhhh Bring on the virgins and ghilmans. I am feeling the need.I am wearing the belt and it may explode anytime soon!
I cna not think any thing else!

Unbelievable. Whahid himself has and still uses hadith to learn how to perform his islamic rituals. Now that whe kafirs can use hadith and quran to point to mad mo's wheelings and dealings, they cry foul

g_blade

We Muslims only use those hadiths which we find convient. Actually we believe in all the hadith but we also have to bear in mind that Non-Muslims don't understand the imporatance of many Hadith and start calling them voilent and abusive and stuff.
You see you can understand the wisdom of these hadith only after you become a true Muslim. It is very easy to become a Muslim actually, all you have to do is to pronouce the declaration of the Islamic faith, and scarifice your ability to think at Allah (sw) altar. Once you do that, you will qualify as a true Muslim and you will also be able to see the wisdom in these hadith.

Sounds too good to be true? Go ahead, prove me a liar. As we have stated in our flexible debate policy, we are firmly committed to fair and balanced debate on matters pertaining to Islam and religious truth. Unlike other religions, Islam is firmly rooted in facts and evidence. Those who tread on this path, are on that "victorious path" which the Prophet Muhammed(P) spoke about, and they will be "victorious and saved"… and this is what we call the people to. The Quran is a book, which contains no errors, no discrepancies or changes. If an objective person were to "examine the truth" they would be forced to conclude that Islam is the true path for mankind. And we intend to prove it.

ExamineTheTruth.com frequently engages in debates, dialogues, and lectures dealing with various topics regarding Islam. At the same time, we encourage full cross-examination of our evidences and arguments, because we know that they are based upon facts, and are irrefutable. Therefore, we are willing to pay air, hotel and meal expense for all "prominent" critics, Islam bashers, or pseudo "Islam experts" to come debate us or challenge what we say. This means, that where ever we deliver a lecture, debate, dialogue in any public setting, we will offer to fly in any "prominent" critic to challenge us! Now, it just doesn’t get any better than that. Unfortunately, we can not extend this invitation to everyone due to limited expenses, but only to "prominent" critics.

Now, we must ask you the reader, a few questions. Considering this great offer coupled with our flexible debate policy, why would these so called "Islam experts" who claim that they want to "expose Islam" not take advantage of it? If their anti Islamic propaganda was really based on true facts as their websites claim, why would they run like cowards? Do you allow a spineless person to represent Jesus? Don’t you think they owe it to YOU to take up this challenge and see if their arguments really hold water? I will submit that there is no legitimate explanation other than they are not truthful about what they are relaying to you. I would also like to ask you if your own religion could duplicate this offer which we have extended. Think about it. When was the last time you ever saw Pat Robertson, Creflo Dollar, or your minister ever invite a critic to challenge the integrity of their religion?

In conclusion, I will predict that none of these pseudo "Islam experts" who pump gallons upon gallons of false propaganda on the internet, TV and bookshelves will dare to take up this challenge. This is because, they know that what they are saying about Islam are nothing but gross distortions, and out right deception. They have been take advantage of a very naïve audience of Christians and Americans, and now, it is time to confront them. And, they are indeed scared.

http://www.examinethetruth.com/expenses.htm

Don't tempt me ibrahim...

Hi # 33. ibrahim;

If you want few more converts better tell in details how to pronounce the Sahada in Arabic with English transliteration and proper translation.

"" Arabic text: أشهد أن لا إله إلاَّ الله و أشهد أن محمد رسول الله Romanization: ʾašhadu ʾanal lā ilāha allah dalla, wa ʾašhadu ʾanas muḥammadar rasūlu l-Lullāh Chode Pilla.

(I witness that; There is no God but Allah the pimp and his only pedophile prophet MoHamMad sodomizes kids )

A single honest recitation of the Shahadah in Arabic is all that is required for a person to become a Muslim .

But I tell you only Criminals and Christians can understand the deep spiritual, intellectual meaning of the Sahadah, as Islam and Qu'rand are based on Bible ( both new and old testicles).

Pedophilia , Sodomy , Rape etc are Halal according to Islam and Christianity as mentioned in Qu'rand and Hadith also in Biblical Old/ New testicles.

Getting in to Islam and getting out of it are both one way streets!
Getting in to Islam is as simple as raping a kafir woaman in moslem land.\Just say the lulla shada thrice in front of other group of brain dead moslems and bingo you are a moslem.
la illahi illallah, mohammada rasool allah ( chode pilla is HPs addition!)
there is no difficulty in doing that.The most difficult thing I found out is to be a moslem , you need to submit your brain and rational thinking ability at the altar of allah and that I believe is not too easy! If you are in sodi barbaria, they will celebrate your conversion with a beef lunch in the mosque or dinner and may be a few riyals are for the take.( now a days they ( sodis)have become smarter and stopped the riyal sop as many people got converted in and ou t of islam to earn riyals!)
Now getting out of islam is also easy.Just think for a few seconds and rationally.Why would allah speak to people only in classical arabic?
Why would allah hate kafirs? and just ask a few questions and you are out of islam faster than a guy is kicked out of whore house with out money!
Either way thinking faculty of the brain is the key.You have the thinking ability, you will not be either a moslem or a christian.You lack that, you can be either of them.Makes not a difference.
Christendom ( more like dumb christian) is a collection of brain dead people with no rational thinking capacity or is it a society of christians? As per the definition above there is no difference between those who can not think rationally and the moslems and christians!

Sadly, the professor does not have much to say. This is getting boring because you are only talking about the authenticity of the hadith...

I am also going to convert to Islam. Dr. Wahid has convinced me the greatness of Allah; the benefits of believing Allah and Mohammed. Yet I have to admit I have an ulterior motive: whenever I look at another woman my wife is suspicious. I want ot make her silent by marrying four more women, when I become a muslim she cannot object to it. Since she has no job and no mney she will have have to adjust to our new Islamic way of life. And Dr. Wahid's statement that Islam is growing very fast I believe him because he is educated, has Ph.D Doctor. Naturally what he says must be true and logical.

Yet I request Dr. Wahid to explain the wonderful thing our belove prophet did in splitting the moon! Even before becoming a muslim I have already realized or 'felt' the spirituality in the following islamic practice:
1. thighing infants
2. thighing or pervet sex with pre-pubescent girls
3. wife beating (I want to beat my wife, a thing I never did as a kafir)
4. raping kafir women
5. looting their property
Oh, Allah, there is no end to the benefits becoming a muslim
Allah-hu Akbar, La Illa ha illahha! Lo! Allah is all knowing, merciful.

My dear # 38. Kaalan:

We need( I mean Islam needs) converts like you, PK, ibrahim and Halalpork etc.to force Islam to fight it's sister Xianity. which is as evil or more evil as Islam.

Only poison can counter other poison .

So think before you post your comments.

Without the hadiths one can not understand the Quran and Islamic history. Such is their close relationship.For centuries no one has questioned the authenticity of the hadhits and Muslims have taken them at face value. Barring a few outlandish hadiths like the splitting of the moon by the Prophet the hadiths are consistent with the Quran. Suddenly these hadiths have become too uncomfortable for the liking of many muslims who want to disassociate themselves with them.The hadiths have become too hot to handle. The Muslim apologists are deluding themselves. They are in a damage control mode after 14 centuries!! The light of truth has dawned.Give and take another 3-4 decades and things will get even worse for muslim apologists. Damn those who compiled the hadiths!

Qrand is filth. That's the truth.
Hadiths are filthier.That's the bigger truth.
Moslems are stupidest to believe and act as per qrand and hadiths. Biggest truth.
Now comes the reofrmation process in islam.
Moslems are embarassed about the filth in hadith.So they wanted no body to know the filth.They pushed it under he carpet, arabian please.Now internet ha sopened up the infidels power of understanding the islamic filth.So the nominal moslems rae concerned.They have now converted to qrand only moslems.
Follower of a filth is filth

Barring a few outlandish hadiths like the one about the splitting of the moon by the Prophet, the majority of hadiths are authentic and in concordance with the Quran. For centuries no one has doubted their authenticity but now they have become too uncomfortable to the liking of many Muslims. They have become too hot to handle after 14 centuries!! No wonder deluded Muslims who are still hoping againts hope are in damage control mode and want to disassociate themselves with them. Damn those compilers!

Qu'rand with it's Hadiths and Bible with it's old and new testicles are obsolete garbages. Politicians have been exploiting those for their own evil purpose only.

It sounds funny to read about the conflicts.

Islam and Christianity have never tried to update those evil books; the so called books supposedly containing the words of the God/s. Dead things serve the evil purposes of the power hungry politicians , like the Pope, the Mullahs and the Ayatollahs.

What a feast, this article and its comments. Ali Sina 'rocks" at his best. I was also informed, impressed and in agreement with many comments, especially of the Indian people. I had a good time with the humor too!

In Holland we have a saying "Do not throw away the child with the washing-
water". It looks like Dr Wahid distinquishes between the child, the Quran and the washing-water, the Ahadith. But I suppose we think it's all washing-water.

Dr. Wahid asks Ali Sina to prove the veracity of the Ahadith which he uses. But really, all Ali Sina is doing is to provide (very) reasonable doubt about the extraordinary claim of Muslim clerical leaders that Islam is the literal truth from God. Or their claim how useful Islam can be. I think it is safe to say that at least some of us do not find Islam as much more useful than some other ideologies or religions we are familiar with.

Meeting in Holland some Iranians in opposition to the Ayatollahs I also mentioned the role of Islam in Iran. But these guys, while having seen thousands upon thousands killed by the Ayatollahs and all their other inhumane and stupid behavior in the name of Islam, in deadly opposition to them, still maintained that it was not because of the religion! Then they told me, ignorant Westerner, this story of Mohammed and the insulting woman and him caring about her, like it was told here! And I was confused, thinking, hey, this must have come from the Quran/ Ahadith also. It looks like there were 2 Muhammads, obviously a very good one next to the bad one. But it was a fabrication.

The Quran-only-movement seemingly has new, interesting and promising opinions about a lot of Muslim lawlimss and behavior, like the treatment of adulterers and even women which Dr Wahid told us about. It must be a reaction to Islam-criticism, which so recently started.

But my political-correct compatriots, along with many Muslims, keep whining: Oh, by criticizing Islam in a biting, insulting way, you only make the Muslims become more hurt, angry and radical, so don't do it. And it is NOT NICE, unfair, discriminatory etc. to them. Hah! Now we see this Quran-only-reaction, which is great because there now is a new genuine split in Islam. And really, half of Islam is already being discarded by some. Muslims are trying to be rational and reasonable, much more than before. What a great effect, that we see unfolding for our eyes. Thank you Ali Sina and keep doing the good work!

Nr 34, Awakedhewe said:

"Therefore, we are willing to pay air, hotel and meal expense for all “prominent” critics, Islam bashers, or pseudo “Islam experts” to come debate us or challenge what we say. This means, that where ever we deliver a lecture, debate, dialogue in any public setting, we will offer to fly in any “prominent” critic to challenge us! Now, it just doesn’t get any better than that."

Isn't this already happening a lot? We see it on TV, YouTube, websites all the time. Also with followers of other religions, like Christians, Atheists. You can ask Geert Wilders, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Wafa Sultan, Robert Spencer, they are also prominent "Pseudo Islam experts". There exist prominent Western Islamologists as well.

Ali Sina is doing fine on this website, he does not owe us to take up such a challenge and expose himself, obliging him to have bodyguards like Ayaan Hirsi Ali all her life. He already has a very flexible debate policy too. Please confront him as much as you want. He may be scared, but not of logical arguments!

this debate reminds me of the debate Ali Sina had with the guy who was bent upon disproving the narcissist syndrome expert...Mr. Wahid is not a true muslim because a true muslim takes koran and mohammad as it is...and he and every muslim knows that mohammad has handed down only shame to his future generations...

To Dr. Wahid: You want Ali Sina to prove hadiths are true acts of Mohammed.Well the proofs are that a large number of his followers and believers witnessed it and pious scholars chronicled it. Ali Sina asked you to prove that quran is the true word of God. There is not a single witness of God or Gibraeel talking to Mohammed.Muslims are bothered by hadiths stories of Mohammed's killings robberies raids and rapes.But they are all backed by what quran says.Thus even if you throw away all hadiths , Mohammed would still be a killer robber ,polygamist, raider and rapist based on quran and islam will still be a fake ideology because of Quran's contradictions and , ridiculous fairy tales.

To Dr Wahid:I strongly recommend you to read Ayesha Ahmed's Prophet's Biography from Quranic Ayas(http://news.faithfreedom.org/index.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1492). It is written for quran only muslims like you who dont believe in the hadith based biographies..

#34. awakedhewe,
I did not see you mention that you will be send a return air ticket. I guess we all know what it means. You think you can trick islamic critics and then silence them once and for all. But i am afraid you have no idea how many so called muslims have actually apostated. Had it not been for the fear of getting killed which your religion preaches , you would have seen a lot more ex-muslims.